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corekashmiri
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PostSubject: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Wed Oct 01, 2008 4:00 am

Many of you know me as corekashmiri and I beleive i was one of the first few (who doesnt agree with kashmir separating from India) who joined this forum.
When this forum started, the only restriction was 'No obscenities will be tolerated', besides that every one could voice their opinion and discuss.
As you know, i stopped contributing when one of the moderators started censuring based on the NEW rules of the forum, though I kept on following with whats happening, same as what liberalM intends to do.
Over the passage of last few days, same happened with hated-in and now liberalM.
Reason :
Anything which doesn't agree with the sensibilities of pro-kashmir separatism is propaganda, hindutva agenda, misleading information, advertisement etcetra etcetra...
And anything which seems to agree with them is fine.
You will cite articles by scribes,websites which agree to your views as being authentic material , reliable source, kashmir expert Alistair Lamb who is a foreigner is authentic but Kalhana(who was a Kashmiri) who wrote about Kashmir is mystical and not true. Kashmiri professor's who are Doctorates with years of experience and who have lived in kashmir since generations and who give information about history and language of kashmir are non-relaible sources, since you take the decision of who is relaible and who is not.

At least one good thing has happened on this forum ( i dont know whether to call it a forum now),Anyone who visits this forum will know what to expect.

If you are pro-kashmir separatist, you have the privilege to discuss any issue under the sun, no obscenities will be tolerated (pun intended).
If you are not, what ever you would say would fall within the following definitions;
A part of Hindutva brigade,
Indian propaganda machine,
Advertizer,
Anti Muslim, and then what would happen:

'offending statement deleted for not citing a non-relaible source'.
3 strike offs or whatever you call it.

At the same time, one would expect whatever material, opinions, discussions is provided by pro-separation posters is written by the God's own pen, similar to the line :

La-illaha -ill-lal-lah, Mahmud-ur-rasool-Allah ( There is NO GOD but ALLAH, and Mohammed is his prophet).

So farewell my friends, have a tough and rigorous debate within the confines of your rules.
Hail Hitler!!!

Chao
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ABC_to_XYZ
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PostSubject: Agreed ---------- Today I am going to be Banned.   Wed Oct 01, 2008 4:58 am

I absolutely agree with coreKashmiri on every point.

@ Mr Admin and All Kashmiris,
Prove all the point below to be wrong before deleting, and I have already striked more than 30 times, so you can ban me right away. But truth cant be hidden and it cant be changed by "3 strike rule"

[deleted by moderator as content is flagged]

And I had summarized the same feeling in one line in one of my earlier post....
That History has taught as the same...

> They will rewrite the history as they want.
> They will start the history from the point they want. (1400 AD is their start)
> They will call the right to as what suits them
> They have done this time and again
> They will erase all marks of your existence.
> They will proclaim to the owner and source of everything good.
> If they are oppressed a bit, Then thats the heinous crime OIC will come to assistance.

> We have one nation and they have OIC (56 nations) and they want to divide this nation.

The classic example is Iran,

Discussion should be not that "Kashmir Problem is like Palestine"
But "Kashmir Problem is like Iran"

A) In Iran Zorastrism was the original religion in history, Arab and Mongol Invaders have successfully reduced it to less than 1 pc

B)
In Afghanistan, remember Bamian Buddhas,
Remember Gandhari the mother of Kauravas was from Kandhar.
Remember Ashoka kingdom was till Kabul.
They have succesfully made the Afganishtan to 100 pc muslim.

C)
Pakistan: On Indepedence it was 30 pc Hindus, Now you will not find even 30 hindu temples.
There is no remeberence of any holy place of Hindus remaining in Pakistan.
Indus valley civilization and Mohenjodaros are just ruins, to be forgotten for ever.
Today Pakistan is successfully 99 pc Muslims.

D)
Kashmir: They claim Kashmir now, and want to rewrite the history, religion, geography, litreature they want.
And they have sucssefully kicked out 4 lakh Kashmiri Pundits. to make it 99 pc Muslims.

If Kashmir is given the stinking "Independence" in the name of humanity then day is not far that other 150 millions muslims will also ask the freedom, then keep giving them their promised land, they will ask their freedom.


Refer to [link to propaganda site deleted by moderator] And go through the various links on to the left of it.
Read the work of [advertising anti-Islam zionists not allowed].
Go through the western History as to what the Jihad of Islamist have done to western world.


So all My dear Kashmiris,
Ban me from this site, but provide the proof if above is wrong.

You are the divisive force which is bent upon causing divide of this Nation Again,
Like we have not yet forgiven Pakistan, You will not be forgiven by True Indians, If you are successful in dividing this Nation again. In time you will meet the destiny.

You cant even tolerate the opinions and suggestions and feelings of other and you expect the other people to be tolerant.
Think about it.

Thanks.
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ABC_to_XYZ
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PostSubject: One Last thing Before I am Banned   Wed Oct 01, 2008 5:06 am

I am snatching the opportunity to write one more post on this forum.


Only one thing I want to say to all Kashmiris,

You have your freedom of everything under article 370 which no other Indian has, still you want freedom.

Today you are Kashmiri to all the Indians, and we are one, Every Indian feel you suffering, they hate the violence and militancy But Once you get your freedom, then All Kashmiris will Be Pakistani for all Indians.

There will be no difference in letter or spirit of India, All Kashmiris will be treated as Pakistani.

And you surely can afford to have a belligrent 1 billion population to your next door.

Mr Admin.

I think I have corrupted your forum enough by now.
Mr Peace, Mr Chinar and All Peace loving Kashmiris can ban me for good.
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Reporter
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Wed Oct 01, 2008 5:23 am

The only time you will be banned is for writing obscene comments. you may indulge in any diatribe you wish. It just causes headaches for moderators but according to the rules of the forum is not the basis for you being banned.

Three strikes rule for personal attacks, trolling, disrespect to any religion.
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corekashmiri
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PostSubject: @All   Wed Oct 01, 2008 7:50 am

Carrying on my post forward which is being handled by the so called GENNEXT of kashmir and the likes of which would have the reins of power if kashmir were to separate will we expect to see the following:

Intolerance to views of different communities as is seen here on this forum vis a vis branding anything u dont agree with different brands (propaganda, hindutva agenda, misleading information, advertisement)
censuring anything which goes against the whim and fancies of the rulers (same as moderators of this forum).
you will be shown a dream aka

Only rules are : No obscene language will be tolerated.
Write your heart out! No comments will be censored. The only condition is that use of obscene profanity will result in your IP address being banned forever! Please enjoy your discussion about Kashmir here and thankyou for your comments.

And then when you speak your heart out, your heart will literally be taken out, exactly on the same lines of whats happening with their religion brothers in pakistan/afghanistan/iran/iraq etcetra etcetra...
Just like the comments are cleaned out, banned for various reasons.

And thats what i meant by the subject of this post "This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris".

A grim picture if this were to happen in kashmir, the way it happened and is happening on this forum.

I love Kashmir and many like me won't let that happen.

I promise you that.
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Kilo
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Wed Oct 01, 2008 8:40 am

Classic case of making oneself appear as the victims!

This forum is indeed like the future Kashmir. There will be laws and everyone will be treated equally according to the law of the land.

The moderators have deleted many posts of Kashmiri muslims as well because they did not adhere to the rules.

The future Kashmir, just like this forum will always keep the interests of Kashmiris at the forefront.

Admin and moderators, keep up the good work.
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ABC_to_XYZ
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PostSubject: @Kilo   Wed Oct 01, 2008 8:55 am

Thanks Kilo for Justifying CRPF shooting and Atrocities

(If you just replace the word Kashmir by India in your post.)

Since its law of land, and all separitist activities including raising the enemies flag can not be tolerated, including throwing stones on the police cant be tolerated,

on the same taken as you have upheld the proven unreasonable acts of this forum, It is very easy to prove the sanity of CRPF and other atrocities on fellow kashmiries.

I am surely the 2-3 kashmiries on this forum represent only one section of kashmir and millions of kashmiris (reasonable, peace loving and kind hearted) wont follow it.
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:52 am

@abc.

No it doesnt work, I tried replacing Kashmiris with Indians and it still doesnt justify the horrendous crimes of the Indian Army and CRPF in Kashmir.

Quote :
The moderators have deleted many posts of Kashmiri muslims as well because they did not adhere to the rules.

A similar sentence with Indian Army comparison according to your logic would be

"The Indian Army has killed/raped/maimed/kidnapped/burnt down entire villages of many Indian Hindus as well because they did not adhere to Indian laws"

See it doesnt apply.
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ABC_to_XYZ
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:58 am

Is there any Hindu left in the valley by Kashmiri Millitants?

And the allegation you mentioned needs proofs as per this forum.
Else it should be deleted.
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:00 am

And it does apply

It doesnt matter it Hindu Maoist/Naxalites or Kashmiri MIllitants.
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peace
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PostSubject: @abc   Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:32 pm

dear brother its a very emotional write-up that u have written and i appreciate but only for the one who is ignorant and arrogant regarding kashmir issue..i will partially agree with u regarding deleting of so many posts and comments by the moderators but i will not discuss that coz i did not join the forum to debate about the work of moderators and others but kashmir problem and what could be the solution...
but the problem that i find with ur views which i and u have the right to criticize or to agree with is the lack of ground reality..brother how many kashmiri pandits do u want to meet in kashmir valley even today..in this forum i have tried to be as neutral as well as truthfull as i could be and that is why i even requested admin and moderators not to delete to so many posts but ultimatley it is there call not mine...kashmiri pandits still exists in kashmir..i had to my best knowledge 4 pandit teachers in my school along with some pandit students..no doubt the numbers reduced drastically but there reasons for leaving the valley are itself controvercial and even discussed to some extent in a thread in the forum...kashmiri pandits still run the temples here..
i dnt see a point by u comparing kashmir with iran..there is no land dispute in iran..if u talk about Zorastrism in iran being reduced to 1 pc then what about hinduism in kashmir itself when it was reduced by buddhists..i am sure u must know the influence of buddhism on kashmir..the last non-muslim ruler of kashmir was infact a budh and not a hindu..i can go on writing but that is not the purpose of my discussion....
Quote :
In Afghanistan, remember Bamian Buddhas,
Remember Gandhari the mother of Kauravas was from Kandhar.
Remember Ashoka kingdom was till Kabul.
They have succesfully made the Afganishtan to 100 pc muslim
if u remember bamian buddhas then i am sure u would remember babri masjid too or dnt u..!!!and yes the recent attacks on christian chirches and nuns...afghanistan is a problem created by USA and ISI and america portrays it as islamic extremism and terrorism and u people are following it with closed eyes..judge things accordingly..isnt USA,INDIA,PAKISTAN themselves terrorist states???
if afghanistan turned into 100% muslim then where is the problem brother...spain got converted to christanity from islam and that too 100%..!!!kashmir succesfully got reverted back to islam at large..is there any problem in that too if people change there relegion by will or would u say they too were coverted by force..so what if ashoka ruled over kabul..what are u trying to prove..read kalhana then.lalitaditya ruled over north india till kashgar..so what..what does it prove then???
....every country has its problems and no single country is an angel...india too has problems..
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ABC_to_XYZ
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:51 pm

Following comparison are naive, none here is supporting acts of Fundamentalist (Even if its Hindu)
I have not mentioned any where that I have supported Hindu Fundamentalism
No Hindu Temples or organisation support Bajrang Dal or its activites
Its being banned many times earlier and it should be banned again.


As regards as Babri Masjid is concerned:
It was the birth place of Ram, on which Babur built the masjid.
Now if some-one build a church in Mecca .......... What will you do?
And then people ask for proof of Birth of Ram
Lets ask the proof of Existence of Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) too ....

Are we accounting how many temples and mosques were razed by Arab Invaders
Somnath temple itself is said to be razed more than half a dozen time.
There is mosque adjacent to temple in Varanasi and Mathura as well
Lets compare this to a Masjid in Vatican and a church next to Mecca.

Purely Pathetic display of reasoning ..

====================================


Recent attack on christian:
They are widely condemed and Bajrang Dal leaders are arrested
http://www.hindu.com/2008/09/21/stories/2008092157110100.htm
http://www.outlookindia.com/pti_news.asp?id=102777
And its futile to mention here that those chritian missionaries were charged to convert the tribals forcefully
Now the only problem Bajrang dal took a wrong path and they didnt go to the court for that.
But Any atrocities on any HUMAN is absolutely wrong and it will and should get punished
====================================


Your knowledge of histroy is truly limited,
America came in history only 300 odd years ago and its only 20th century and world war II that it became super power.

====================================

Regarding which state can be declared terrorist,
All of us know the answer to them, you can turn your blind eye because of your ignorance.

====================================


You can compare the ratio between Islamic Fundamentalist activities to Sum of other religions.

Its pathetic that I have keep telling history which everyone knows.

====================================
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ABC_to_XYZ
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:55 pm

As long as the history of conversion is concerned
I dont have to reason much,
Every one knows ....

Only after conversion one fails to admit

And why mostly Islam is questioned of this conversion

We can have different forum to discuss conversion, I dont want to waste this forum time for that.

But good luck with you reasoning and thoughts.
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Thu Oct 02, 2008 12:01 am

Regarding Hindusim and Buddihsm

I dont know how much you know of both
But Gautam Buddha is worshipped as 9th Vishnu Avatar.
He is very much part of Hindusim and pillar of Hinduism

Hinduism is not one religion. (again you will call me Hinduatva agent)

In south within Hindu, a shaiv and vaishnav will not agree.

There was never a fight for buddisim,

All Hindus including me take our teaching from Buddha, he has purified our reasoning..

But with whom am I trying to reason?

I am a Hindu but still I will say the Buddisht Philospohy is the best and many many many Hindus think alike.

You take care man... Its not getting anywhere.
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ABC_to_XYZ
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Thu Oct 02, 2008 12:10 am

How far one has to go for reasoning.

@Admin/Moderators

I should beg you apology, as I dont want to get into religious discourse here and How religions compare.
This is endless discussion.

@Mr Peace,
I am not sure if serves any purpose to discuss the details of religions here.
But I gave you reasoning for Babri Masjid,
You can always choose to see one side of the coin and call yourself to be correct.

(You know it takes lot of time and effort to go through the details then just to make an statement here and there)

The world famous historian, Will Durant has written in his 'Story of Civilization' that "the Mohammedan conquest of India was probably the bloodiest story in history".

This discourse will never end, you can live happily with your thoughts. I have no problem and no intention to change it.
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Thu Oct 02, 2008 12:13 am

@Admin/Moderators

Please stop this religious questions and discourses
you may delete my entries if you will.
I didn't intend to initiate the discussion on these lines.

thanks
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Thu Oct 02, 2008 12:15 am

brother there is no need to get frustrated by a response which dosent suit ur views..i have already written that we will surely disagree with each other but need to have a healthy debate..

i have nowhere written that u support Hindu Fundamentalism..if i have pls show me..so i request u to read the posts with calm mind and less hatred towards kashmiris..


Quote :
And its futile to mention here that those chritian missionaries were charged to convert the tribals forcefully
if u would know that the same missionaries are with the same procedure trying to convert muslims in kashmir in far off villages and target only poor people..but the relegious and social forces in kashmir have been tolerant and conscious of the fact that voilent actions would undermine there own credibilty..i am sure u are not trying to justify the actions against the christians by HINDU EXTREMISTS AND HINDU FUNDAMENTALISTS of the largest democracy of the world by mentioning the reasons behind the inhuman action...
thankyou for reminding me about the number of years of existance of america but i dnt see where i was wrong when i mentioned the way america portrays afghanistan or iraq..america came into existence 300 years back but i am mentioning about its policies in 21st century..how are the two related brother...maybe i have less understanding than an intellectual like u..
Quote :
Regarding which state can be declared terrorist,
All of us know the answer to them, you can turn your blind eye because of your ignorance
agreed...or if i can put it this way that i am turning a blind eye due to my ignorance and u are due to ur arrogance or due to ur patriotism..
i am sorry if it is a hectic process for u to repeat and teach the same history to me and others again and again...
there is something that i would like to learn from u then...
1) define Islamic Fundamentalist for me..
2) brief me about crusaders and do they fit in the same category then??
3) does the story of mahabharta fit in the same category??
4) arabs who invaded india???
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Thu Oct 02, 2008 12:17 am

give me you yahoo or gmail iD peace we can take this discussion there.

I can try to answer all your question there.

No point in hurting many people sentiments here and defeating the purpose of this forum.
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Thu Oct 02, 2008 12:21 am

[color=red]THIS POST HAS BEEN DELETED[/color]
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Thu Oct 02, 2008 12:35 am

Quote :
I know this doesn't fit in the topic, but heartfelt wishes to everyone here on Eid!
Eid mubarak to you as well ~T and to everyone as well.

First of all I would like to clarify that Reporter resigned as moderator of his own free will and I in no way interfere with the decisions of the moderators as long as they, just like every other member follow the forum rules. I have emphasized from the very beginning that it is necessary to have a set of rules that we all can abide by to prevent the forum being hijacked by persons having a vested interest in maligning one side or the other.

After carefully examining the sites that Hated-in cited, I have to once again, albeit with regret, inform that Reporter made the correct decision in not allowing those sites being advertised here. Here is the reason why. In order for someone to back up a claim that is as serious as accusing Kashmiri muslims of perpetrating rapes on Kashmiri Pandit women, and then encouraging their exodus through warnings from mosque loud-speakers, we need authentic citation from unbiased realiable news sources. Merely mentioning "opinion" articles of persons whose own biases can be questioned to back up your own "opinion" defeats the purpose of requiring citation in the first place.

Through this exercise I hope readers and other members would have learnt that the old saying "Repeat a lie a thousand times and it becomes the truth" really applies to our present discussion.

The fact remains that there are no "news" sources that can be cited because these incidents never took place in the first place.

I hope everyone agrees with my reasoning and sees the logic behind it.
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PostSubject: Resignations and freedom of speech   Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:11 am

First of all Eid Mubarak to everyone.

To all non-Kashmiris(Indians) and Kashmiri Pandits, it is with great remorse and sadness that I bid adieu to all you guys here........ I am fed up of the Indians hijacking every particular topic and time n again blasting Kashmiri muslims for every ill under the sky.

I was invited onto this forum by KOSHUR and did try my best to have a meaningful dialogue despite sometimes coming across ridiculous comments from India Lovers.

I have observed time n again that the Indians try to make us feel guilty for every particular step taken by the forum administrators. There are hundreds of Kashmiri Pandit websites or forums who don't even see my comments, leave alone posting them. I believe that this forum is a hundred thousand times more liberal than KP blogs.

I do however thank liberalmarathi for a meaningful debate and just approach to various scenarios.

Being a Kashmiri, my purposeful work towards awareness of the J&K dispute will continue. Smile
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PostSubject: @All   Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:38 am

Dear Admin and Dear All,

First of all I wish you Eid Mubarak !!!!

Now coming to the topic:

Your Quote:
"After carefully examining the sites that Hated-in cited, I have to once again, albeit with regret, inform that Reporter made the correct decision in not allowing those sites being advertised here. Here is the reason why. In order for someone to back up a claim that is as serious as accusing Kashmiri muslims of perpetrating rapes on Kashmiri Pandit women, and then encouraging their exodus through warnings from mosque loud-speakers, we need authentic citation from unbiased realiable news sources. Merely mentioning "opinion" articles of persons whose own biases can be questioned to back up your own "opinion" defeats the purpose of requiring citation in the first place."

It is so easy to say and so easy to write as an Adminstrator/ Moderator, so easy to censor and accuse some one else of accusing something which you dont beleive in.

In the same breath I can say or any one who doesnt agree with your point of view as YOU being the one who is part of some Islamic Propaganda machine, can easily dismiss your claims as being from an unrelible source etc... and so on,but do we do that, NO? Why because we believe in knowing what you want to show us and what your point of view is. Then it is up to our judgement to decide what is real and what is not.

Anyways for all of us who have access to internet can anyways see both sides of the story. So what is the point of deleting/censoring?
When some of you upload some videos of atrocites by Indian Army, I dont call it a propaganda by you guys,I just take in a stride and agree that its happening and i convince myself that since Kashmir is a war - zone, so what you upload is its colateral -damage, thats how i see it.

You quote some papers and clippets which show your side of the story, I dont dismiss it and say its not an authentic citation from a so called relieable source.

I or anyone who is against your point of view don't say its media propaganda by islamic fundamentalists or anything else. has anyone which includes hated-in, ABC, liberalM,Suchi or any one else done that.
Infact what i observed everyone empathizes with you and the some even take it as the real truth and want to share it with others like suchi who didnt get a chance to hear the other side of the story and why whatever she is being shown by you guys is happening in the first place.

Once again your Quote "The fact remains that there are no "news" sources that can be cited because these incidents never took place in the first place."

Hated-in provided you with newz clippets from from some of the reputed newz agencies of the world, but as per you it is not from "authentic citation from unbiased realiable news sources".
ABC put in some youtube links which showed you the otherside of the strory in exactly the same way you have allowed the youtube links with support your point of view, but you deleted them.
I and I beleive hated-in also actually experienced them, what more do you think you need.

By doing this, the whole purpose with which you started this forum is being defeated.

Not going further with all this, I would make you suggestion. You can take it or trash it:

Keep the forum which you started, the way it was with the rule "No obscenities will be tolerated' .
Put back the enteries made by hated-in, ABC, liberalM back,
Remove the obscenities made by anyone including me.
Leave the discretion of deciding what is propaganda and what is this and what is that to the posters and viewers. Let them see and read both side of the story and take a decision what is propaganda and what is not.

If you put back the enteries made by hated-in, ABC, I would get to know that you agree, but if you don't, then Good bye the last time from my side too.
And the purpose of this forum will be defeated.

Just saw Chinaar too is leaving, I had really enjoyed his and liberalM's discussion. This is what will happen
regards
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PostSubject: @All   Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:42 am

I apologize, I had to post my entry here:

Dear Admin and Dear All,

First of all I wish you Eid Mubarak !!!!

Now coming to the topic:

Your Quote:
"After carefully examining the sites that Hated-in cited, I have to once again, albeit with regret, inform that Reporter made the correct decision in not allowing those sites being advertised here. Here is the reason why. In order for someone to back up a claim that is as serious as accusing Kashmiri muslims of perpetrating rapes on Kashmiri Pandit women, and then encouraging their exodus through warnings from mosque loud-speakers, we need authentic citation from unbiased realiable news sources. Merely mentioning "opinion" articles of persons whose own biases can be questioned to back up your own "opinion" defeats the purpose of requiring citation in the first place."

It is so easy to say and so easy to write as an Adminstrator/ Moderator, so easy to censor and accuse some one else of accusing something which you dont beleive in.

In the same breath I can say or any one who doesnt agree with your point of view as YOU being the one who is part of some Islamic Propaganda machine, can easily dismiss your claims as being from an unrelible source etc... and so on,but do we do that, NO? Why because we believe in knowing what you want to show us and what your point of view is. Then it is up to our judgement to decide what is real and what is not.

Anyways for all of us who have access to internet can anyways see both sides of the story. So what is the point of deleting/censoring?
When some of you upload some videos of atrocites by Indian Army, I dont call it a propaganda by you guys,I just take in a stride and agree that its happening and i convince myself that since Kashmir is a war - zone, so what you upload is its colateral -damage, thats how i see it.

You quote some papers and clippets which show your side of the story, I dont dismiss it and say its not an authentic citation from a so called relieable source.

I or anyone who is against your point of view don't say its media propaganda by islamic fundamentalists or anything else. has anyone which includes hated-in, ABC, liberalM,Suchi or any one else done that.
Infact what i observed everyone empathizes with you and the some even take it as the real truth and want to share it with others like suchi who didnt get a chance to hear the other side of the story and why whatever she is being shown by you guys is happening in the first place.

Once again your Quote "The fact remains that there are no "news" sources that can be cited because these incidents never took place in the first place."

Hated-in provided you with newz clippets from from some of the reputed newz agencies of the world, but as per you it is not from "authentic citation from unbiased realiable news sources".
ABC put in some youtube links which showed you the otherside of the strory in exactly the same way you have allowed the youtube links with support your point of view, but you deleted them.
I and I beleive hated-in also actually experienced them, what more do you think you need.

By doing this, the whole purpose with which you started this forum is being defeated.

Not going further with all this, I would make you suggestion. You can take it or trash it:

Keep the forum which you started, the way it was with the rule "No obscenities will be tolerated' .
Put back the enteries made by hated-in, ABC, liberalM back,
Remove the obscenities made by anyone including me.
Leave the discretion of deciding what is propaganda and what is this and what is that to the posters and viewers. Let them see and read both side of the story and take a decision what is propaganda and what is not.

If you put back the enteries made by hated-in, ABC, I would get to know that you agree, but if you don't, then Good bye the last time from my side too.
And the purpose of this forum will be defeated.

Just saw Chinaar too is leaving, I had really enjoyed his and liberalM's discussion. This is what will happen
regards
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Reporter
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PostSubject: Re: This forum: A Classic Case Study of the problems of Kashmir and kashmiris   Thu Oct 02, 2008 3:19 am

@everyone

Eid mubarak to everyone and thankyou corekashmiri for wishing given the recent animosity between us.

First of all I would like to confirm what Admin has already announced that I am no longer one of the moderators. It is my own decision and I am glad I made it.

This will allow mHe to debate without being held back by the responsibilities of moderating at the same time.

I have to disagree with corekashmiri as hated-in's links were opinion articles on anti-kashmir website and rediff.com.

Authentic unbiased sources would include something along the lines that liberalM posted; HRW, Amnesty, and news sites such as Times of India, Hindu, and the other Indian national media, or any other reputed international media.

Why is it that the mainstream Indian media has no mention of these supposed incidents? why is it that only biased opinion articles by questionable authors are provided. Is it really the case as Admin pointed out, that the propagators of this lie want to attempt the "a lie told a thousand times becomes the truth" trick?

Even though the mainstream Indian media is rabidly anti-Kashmir and anti-Kashmiri muslim, why is it that even they never reported these incidents? The answer is that because they never occured in the first place.

I hope those who are accusing this forum of "suppression" of free speech and accusing us of discrimination finally cool down and think about what I just said in a calm and logical way. Maybe then it might start to make sense that the enemies of Kashmir have been feeding them lies and they have fallen for that.
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PostSubject: @reporter   Thu Oct 02, 2008 3:34 am

Dear Reporter, read my previous post slowly and patiently.
And then answer what you want to.
I do not want to repeat again what I already said about the definitions of reliable sources and propaganda and so on which you have once again repeated.

What i want is a free forum as it was when it was started.

Now i will just wait for Admin to do his duties if he wishes to.
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